It's happening people!

I am not a fan of the decision that dictates which ending you get in the original RE3 because the decision seems completely unrelated to the events that play out. If it does make a return I hope it works out more like in RE1 or RE7 where the things you do are very clearly what lead to the outcome you get.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

And while on that topic, I wonder if the remake will have different endings and split moments in the story.

With the way RE2make mishandled RE2's A/B scenarios, I have my doubts about the different endings.

That is true. While I really liked how the game was remade I wasn't a fan of the clearly last minute addition of the second scenarios. More to play but the differences were so minute and only reserved for a couple of pieces of dialogue, mostly at the beginning and end, that they felt almost completely pointless.

And I mean, it was a last minute addition. In early interviews they said there wouldn't be a second set of scenarios and just before the game came out they mentioned adding something because they had time left. So yeah, not really much went into those. Even just Claire and Leon's scenarios in general felt a little too samey, especially with the repeated boss battles.

I'm just hoping they would've taken the feedback they got from those to heart.


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On a completely unrelated note, I'm really looking forward to seeing how they remake the opening of RE3.



They kept most of RE2's original opening and added a bunch to it so it would be neat to see more of the initial battle against the undead like what can be glimpsed in the original opening of 3. Plus, I really like the theme song (especially the part when UBCS comes in) and just the thought of hearing that with a little more oomph to it gives me goosebumps. On a side note, the UBCS definitely needs their own theme. I don't really count the two songs from Mercenaries as their "theme". Then again, they did such a good job giving HUNK a cool new theme with Looming Dread so, as long as the minigame is included, I'm excited to hear its soundtrack.

Oh, and can't forget the moment that traumatized me as a child. Can't wait to see this in its new, gory, glory.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

And while on that topic, I wonder if the remake will have different endings and split moments in the story.

With the way RE2make mishandled RE2's A/B scenarios, I have my doubts about the different endings.

That is true. While I really liked how the game was remade I wasn't a fan of the clearly last minute addition of the second scenarios. More to play but the differences were so minute and only reserved for a couple of pieces of dialogue, mostly at the beginning and end, that they felt almost completely pointless.

And I mean, it was a last minute addition. In early interviews they said there wouldn't be a second set of scenarios and just before the game came out they mentioned adding something because they had time left. So yeah, not really much went into those. Even just Claire and Leon's scenarios in general felt a little too samey, especially with the repeated boss battles.

I'm just hoping they would've taken the feedback they got from those to heart.

The original B scenario had the usual trope of traps and puzzles being inexplicably "reset" for the later sequence, but at least it had clear signs that Leon or Claire had been there before hand and some sporadic interaction between them. RE2make basically just forgets about the second character after that first cutscene at the back fence (don't even get me started on the unneeded addition of Leon and Claire acting like teenagers crushing on each other in it) until the end of the game when the other character inexplicably waltzes in through the door on the train. It was like, "Oh, right, you were out there, too. I kinda forgot. Glad you made it, though!"

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On a completely unrelated note, I'm really looking forward to seeing how they remake the opening of RE3.

[snipped for space]

They kept most of RE2's original opening and added a bunch to it so it would be neat to see more of the initial battle against the undead like what can be glimpsed in the original opening of 3. Plus, I really like the theme song (especially the part when UBCS comes in) and just the thought of hearing that with a little more oomph to it gives me goosebumps. On a side note, the UBCS definitely needs their own theme. I don't really count the two songs from Mercenaries as their "theme". Then again, they did such a good job giving HUNK a cool new theme with Looming Dread so, as long as the minigame is included, I'm excited to hear its soundtrack.

RE3 had the best opening cutscene of any RE game, IMO. It didn't have the issue of the player characters not knowing the city had fallen, so Capcom were able to go all out with it. I just hope the military blockade of the city gets some kind of acknowledgement.

Let's just ignore how Leon and Claire just drove right in when, logically, every road for miles out would have been cordoned off. And that a large-scale US military deployment within the borders of the United States wouldn't not be plastered on every TV and newspaper in America.

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Oh, and can't forget the moment that traumatized me as a child. Can't wait to see this in its new, gory, glory.

[snipped for space]

Assuming his death is revised or changed altogether. I think it's likely he'll still die by Nemesis because it is one of RE3's story "bullet points", but it could happen in a completely different place and a completely different way.

Ghost Leader wrote:

The original B scenario had the usual trope of traps and puzzles being inexplicably "reset" for the later sequence, but at least it had clear signs that Leon or Claire had been there before hand and some sporadic interaction between them. RE2make basically just forgets about the second character after that first cutscene at the back fence (don't even get me started on the unneeded addition of Leon and Claire acting like teenagers crushing on each other in it) until the end of the game when the other character inexplicably waltzes in through the door on the train. It was like, "Oh, right, you were out there, too. I kinda forgot. Glad you made it, though!"

It's weird how they still make a point of giving them the walkie-talkies yet they barely make any use of them. Instead we get those short letters in the B scenarios that say "Oh yeah I was here too. Cya soon! xoxo"

I think part of the reason they cut down their interaction time was to put more emphasis on Leon and Ada's budding romance. That is actually something they said they wanted to bring more forth with the remake during an interview. Still it somehow backfired and the internet blew up with Leon/Claire shipping.

Ghost Leader wrote:

RE3 had the best opening cutscene of any RE game, IMO. It didn't have the issue of the player characters not knowing the city had fallen, so Capcom were able to go all out with it. I just hope the military blockade of the city gets some kind of acknowledgement.

Let's just ignore how Leon and Claire just drove right in when, logically, every road for miles out would have been cordoned off. And that a large-scale US military deployment within the borders of the United States wouldn't not be plastered on every TV and newspaper in America.

RE3 has one of the best opening videos on the entire PS1 in my opinion.

You know it's weird how only Outbreak seems to actually show the military blockade. I know a plan to quarantine the city is at least mentioned in Operation Raccoon City when the Spec Ops are sent in.

I don't know if this is just fan theory, since there is absolutely no source for this on the RE Wiki, but at least there it says Leon and Claire were able to drive into the city because the blockade had failed at points due to the great numbers of the undead. It at least seems plausible that they managed to drive through while any possible new team had yet to come. As for the news coverage, at least according to RE6 and some tidbits in other games, the situation was reported on the news but both the scale and reason were greatly downplayed. Since the internet was not that big of a deal back then news sources were also limited and all communications to and from the city were cut.

On a side note, surprisingly the live action movies also show the blockade, though it was on a totally different scale from the games. The thing was huge.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

Oh, and can't forget the moment that traumatized me as a child. Can't wait to see this in its new, gory, glory.

[snipped for space]

Assuming his death is revised or changed altogether. I think it's likely he'll still die by Nemesis because it is one of RE3's story "bullet points", but it could happen in a completely different place and a completely different way.

I wonder if his exclusion from 2 is any hint on what happens to him.

Mass Distraction wrote:

I don't know if this is just fan theory, since there is absolutely no source for this on the RE Wiki, but at least there it says Leon and Claire were able to drive into the city because the blockade had failed at points due to the great numbers of the undead. It at least seems plausible that they managed to drive through while any possible new team had yet to come.

That doesn't really work because there were no signs whatsoever of a blockade ever having been present. Even if it was overrun, there would be Humvees, deuce and a halfs, barricades, concertina wire, gun emplacements, and so on. Not to mention the undead that supposedly overran it. Instead, there was nothing, it was just an empty rural road.

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As for the news coverage, at least according to RE6 and some tidbits in other games, the situation was reported on the news but both the scale and reason were greatly downplayed. Since the internet was not that big of a deal back then news sources were also limited and all communications to and from the city were cut.

There would be enough coverage to get the message "Don't come to Raccoon City" out across the entire state (and possibly neighboring states), though. There's no way Leon or Claire would have missed it.

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I wonder if his exclusion from 2 is any hint on what happens to him.

Like I said, I think he'll still die by Nemesis, but the circumstances might be different. As far as the lore is concerned, he was killed by Nemesis in Raccoon City and that's kind of it. Exacting details are hardly ever references elsewhere.

Leon probably would have come into the city even with knowledge of the outbreak to perform his duty as a cop. I mean, after going through all of this he was telling Ada he was going to arrest her... while he was in a secret underground lab battling monsters and the undead.. he very clearly prioritizes his job over his own life.

Claire probably would have come into the city also. Even after she saw what was going on with the outbreak her priority was still to find Chris. She didn't make it her goal to leave the city until after she discovered he was not there.

As for the blockades.. Leon and Claire hit a "road block" in the form of concrete road barriers (small enough that any zombie could easily crawl over or walk around). As Leon/Claire get closer to the station there are a lot more of this road barriers setup with many more cars packed against them. There is also several police cars parked in front of the RPD in a defensive position similar to the cops that were over run in the RE3 intro. Did that intro battle in RE3 take place outside of the RPD? I think there is only 1 police car out there before the first Nemesis encounter.

Ssplain wrote:

Leon probably would have come into the city even with knowledge of the outbreak to perform his duty as a cop. I mean, after going through all of this he was telling Ada he was going to arrest her... while he was in a secret underground lab battling monsters and the undead.. he very clearly prioritizes his job over his own life.

Claire probably would have come into the city also. Even after she saw what was going on with the outbreak her priority was still to find Chris. She didn't make it her goal to leave the city until after she discovered he was not there.

None of that would have mattered, because they both would have been turned away at gunpoint regardless of their reasons for coming to Racoon City. But that goes back into my point that there were absolutely no signs of a blockade ever having been present.

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As for the blockades.. Leon and Claire hit a "road block" in the form of concrete road barriers (small enough that any zombie could easily crawl over or walk around). As Leon/Claire get closer to the station there are a lot more of this road barriers setup with many more cars packed against them. There is also several police cars parked in front of the RPD in a defensive position similar to the cops that were over run in the RE3 intro. Did that intro battle in RE3 take place outside of the RPD? I think there is only 1 police car out there before the first Nemesis encounter.

That was within the city. A US military blockade would have encompassed not only the city, but at least 10 to 15 miles (or more) of surrounding countryside creating a buffer zone between the infection and military perimeter. And it would have included more than just concrete freeway dividers. The explanation that they passed through an area that had been abandoned due to monster attacks just doesn't work and the idea that they just didn't know the city was quarantined is laughably absurd because no matter how "downplayed" it was, there would still have been extensive warnings issued telling people not to come to Raccoon City.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

I don't know if this is just fan theory, since there is absolutely no source for this on the RE Wiki, but at least there it says Leon and Claire were able to drive into the city because the blockade had failed at points due to the great numbers of the undead. It at least seems plausible that they managed to drive through while any possible new team had yet to come.

That doesn't really work because there were no signs whatsoever of a blockade ever having been present. Even if it was overrun, there would be Humvees, deuce and a halfs, barricades, concertina wire, gun emplacements, and so on. Not to mention the undead that supposedly overran it. Instead, there was nothing, it was just an empty rural road.

Just checked the remake opening. We don't really see much before or after the gas station. In any game, for that matter. For all we know the blockade was closer to the city and the undead crowding at Mizoil were those that got through it. After the Raccoon City sign, a bit after the station, the game just skips to showing bits of the city and then Leon and Claire are already in the city. There were not even city lights in sight after they took the cruiser and drove off, which means the city was still quite a ways in the distance.

Ghost Leader wrote:

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As for the news coverage, at least according to RE6 and some tidbits in other games, the situation was reported on the news but both the scale and reason were greatly downplayed. Since the internet was not that big of a deal back then news sources were also limited and all communications to and from the city were cut.

There would be enough coverage to get the message "Don't come to Raccoon City" out across the entire state (and possibly neighboring states), though. There's no way Leon or Claire would have missed it.

In his original backstory Leon was with his girlfriend (and got wasted the day before) before coming to Raccoon and Claire was driving her motorcycle from God only knows how far. They both arrive on the 29th and the outbreak started on the 24th. So that's like 5 days of not watching the news or reading the papers, which I wouldn't think is that far off from the daily life of a ~20-year-old. At least I wasn't that interested in following recent events back then and they both pretty much had their hands full at the time. Especially when the initial coverage for the first couple of days probably wasn't that big anyway since, according to Outbreak, "to cover up the viral outbreak the Pentagon told the press they were investigating radioactivity in the area" which is how they probably explained the blockades as well.

If we take a closer look at the timeline, even people in Raccoon weren't fully aware of the scale of the outbreak until late at night as shown in the first chapter of Outbreak when Jack's Bar was overrun. Military forces didn't set up the blockades until the 25th, shown below. Again, most likely news coverage was limited via higher order (something that was also mentioned in RE6) if they still hoped it could be contained and swept under a rug. The outbreak itself went into full force during the following days.

At least according to that picture the roadblock is closer to the city than what is shown in the opening of RE2 remake. If they had been that close we could've seen the fires in the distance, yet it was pitch black in the distance.

Plus it's a video game so, you know, creative liberties and all that.

Ssplain wrote:

Did that intro battle in RE3 take place outside of the RPD? I think there is only 1 police car out there before the first Nemesis encounter.

I'm pretty sure that's just a random street somewhere. At least in Outbreak the police roadblocks (which are not the roadblock being discussed here) were along the streets of Raccoon City, wherever they still had time to put such things up.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Just checked the remake opening. We don't really see much before or after the gas station. In any game, for that matter. For all we know the blockade was closer to the city and the undead crowding at Mizoil were those that got through it. After the Raccoon City sign, a bit after the station, the game just skips to showing bits of the city and then Leon and Claire are already in the city. There were not even city lights in sight after they took the cruiser and drove off, which means the city was still quite a ways in the distance.

Then, logically, they should have run into some signs of a military presence, like I've been saying.

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In his original backstory Leon was with his girlfriend (and got wasted the day before) before coming to Raccoon and Claire was driving her motorcycle from God only knows how far. They both arrive on the 29th and the outbreak started on the 24th. So that's like 5 days of not watching the news or reading the papers, which I wouldn't think is that far off from the daily life of a ~20-year-old. At least I wasn't that interested in following recent events back then and they both pretty much had their hands full at the time.

If they were coming from a long distance away, they would be stopping for gas, food, bathroom breaks, and all that jazz along the way. That's a lot of opportunities for their destination to get out as part of casual conversation. Not to mention anyone that tried to go into the city, hit a checkpoint, and was turned away would be telling every gas station attendant in the vicinity.

In short, it would have gotten out pretty quick no matter how much they tried to hush it up.

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Especially when the initial coverage for the first couple of days probably wasn't that big anyway since, according to Outbreak, "to cover up the viral outbreak the Pentagon told the press they were investigating radioactivity in the area" which is how they probably explained the blockades as well.

Even as a cover story, if radioactive activity in an area is bad enough that a city needs to be blockaded by the military, travel warnings would be issued. If they were using routine research and monitoring as an excuse, there would be no military presence big enough to quarantine the city.

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If we take a closer look at the timeline, even people in Raccoon weren't fully aware of the scale of the outbreak until late at night as shown in the first chapter of Outbreak when Jack's Bar was overrun.

That's inside the city and can be explained by the communications blackout, though.

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Military forces didn't set up the blockades until the 25th, shown below. Again, most likely news coverage was limited via higher order (something that was also mentioned in RE6) if they still hoped it could be contained and swept under a rug. The outbreak itself went into full force during the following days.

At least according to that picture the roadblock is closer to the city than what is shown in the opening of RE2 remake. If they had been that close we could've seen the fires in the distance, yet it was pitch black in the distance.

And Leon and Claire arrived on the 29th. Now, if they'd arrived within, say, the first 24 hours of the outbreak, it would be reasonable to think the military forces sent just got hung up and were late. But even before their arrival, the military was supposedly there and all set up and even had evac choppers flying in and out of the city.

There's really no logical explanation for Leon and Claire not having learned of the situation before arriving.

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Plus it's a video game so, you know, creative liberties and all that.

More like huge, gaping plot hole that Capcom has no hope whatsoever of being able to fill.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

Just checked the remake opening. We don't really see much before or after the gas station. In any game, for that matter. For all we know the blockade was closer to the city and the undead crowding at Mizoil were those that got through it. After the Raccoon City sign, a bit after the station, the game just skips to showing bits of the city and then Leon and Claire are already in the city. There were not even city lights in sight after they took the cruiser and drove off, which means the city was still quite a ways in the distance.

Then, logically, they should have run into some signs of a military presence, like I've been saying.

Well I mean, at that point they were clearly bent on going to Raccoon anyway even after seeing the undead. For all we know the theorized overrun of the blockades by the zombies happened not long before Leon and Claire passed the then empty checkpoints, the soldiers either dead or in combat further in the woods, and no backup had been able to get there yet. Hell, maybe it happened so fast they didn't even have time to call backup, especially if there was something more deadly than just average zombies getting to them. I doubt no overrun blockade would have made both of our protagonists think "Let's turn back."

Ghost Leader wrote:

If they were coming from a long distance away, they would be stopping for gas, food, bathroom breaks, and all that jazz along the way. That's a lot of opportunities for their destination to get out as part of casual conversation. Not to mention anyone that tried to go into the city, hit a checkpoint, and was turned away would be telling every gas station attendant in the vicinity.

I'm pretty sure both of them, even if they knew something bad was happening, would have still at least tried to get to the city. Maybe they heard the news, bar the whole zombie fiasco, that Raccoon was in a bit of a pickle. Knowing both characters Claire would have tried to get to Chris and Leon would have tried to do his job no matter what. I don't know what their plan would've been to actually get to the city had the army been present but at least they most likely would've tried. The blockade being overrun just moments before they arrive is just a convenient way to skip the story straight to the city instead of having them held up.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Well I mean, at that point they were clearly bent on going to Raccoon anyway even after seeing the undead. For all we know the theorized overrun of the blockades by the zombies happened not long before Leon and Claire passed the then empty checkpoints, the soldiers either dead or in combat further in the woods, and no backup had been able to get there yet. Hell, maybe it happened so fast they didn't even have time to call backup, especially if there was something more deadly than just average zombies getting to them. I doubt no overrun blockade would have made both of our protagonists think "Let's turn back."

Again, there are no trucks, Humvees, gun emplacements, or anything like that which would be there even if the soldiers were driven off. I highly doubt any T-virus mutations are going to stop and let the retreating soldiers clean up any and every sign they were there. And if reinforcements arrived afterward, they wouldn't clean up all those signs, they would make any needed repairs and repopulate the checkpoint.

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I'm pretty sure both of them, even if they knew something bad was happening, would have still at least tried to get to the city. Maybe they heard the news, bar the whole zombie fiasco, that Raccoon was in a bit of a pickle. Knowing both characters Claire would have tried to get to Chris and Leon would have tried to do his job no matter what. I don't know what their plan would've been to actually get to the city had the army been present but at least they most likely would've tried.

I'm not denying that, but it's established that they didn't know which I'm saying there's no way they wouldn't have found out long before arriving.

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The blockade being overrun just moments before they arrive is just a convenient way to skip the story straight to the city instead of having them held up.

Like I've been saying, what blockade? It was an empty rural road.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

Well I mean, at that point they were clearly bent on going to Raccoon anyway even after seeing the undead. For all we know the theorized overrun of the blockades by the zombies happened not long before Leon and Claire passed the then empty checkpoints, the soldiers either dead or in combat further in the woods, and no backup had been able to get there yet. Hell, maybe it happened so fast they didn't even have time to call backup, especially if there was something more deadly than just average zombies getting to them. I doubt no overrun blockade would have made both of our protagonists think "Let's turn back."

Again, there are no trucks, Humvees, gun emplacements, or anything like that which would be there even if the soldiers were driven off. I highly doubt any T-virus mutations are going to stop and let the retreating soldiers clean up any and every sign they were there. And if reinforcements arrived afterward, they wouldn't clean up all those signs, they would make any needed repairs and repopulate the checkpoint.

Well yeah but... we don't even see a great stretch of the road from the gas station to the city. It's not like the city just straight up starts after they leave Mizoil. The soldiers likely just didn't fall back so much that any of it would actually be seen in the cutscenes that show very little of the road leading up to Raccoon. We see Leon and Claire leave Mizoil, then the video just straight skips to them in the city. We don't even see a mile worth of the road in the game and I'm pretty sure it was way longer than that. Every other iteration of the events either starts with the characters already within city limits or on a main road not even close to the city, apart from Outbreak that actually shows us more of the road, including the blockades. Just because we don't see all of the road doesn't mean it doesn't exist. When they got to the blockade, which we never see them do because all of the games just skip this part of the journey, they drove past it, through it, or whatever. It really is not an important plot point.

Ghost Leader wrote:

it's established that they didn't know which I'm saying there's no way they wouldn't have found out long before arriving.

Has it really been explicitly stated that they knew literally nothing was going on in the city? In the remake of 2 I'm pretty sure it's even mentioned Leon went to the city because he knew something was going on and had received a hasty phone call urging him not to go, yet he did anyway. Maybe a complete news blackout is not 100% realistic but it does make sense in a fictional continuity that very little info got out.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Well yeah but... we don't even see a great stretch of the road from the gas station to the city. It's not like the city just straight up starts after they leave Mizoil. The soldiers likely just didn't fall back so much that any of it would actually be seen in the cutscenes that show very little of the road leading up to Raccoon. We see Leon and Claire leave Mizoil, then the video just straight skips to them in the city. We don't even see a mile worth of the road in the game and I'm pretty sure it was way longer than that. Every other iteration of the events either starts with the characters already within city limits or on a main road not even close to the city, apart from Outbreak that actually shows us more of the road, including the blockades. Just because we don't see all of the road doesn't mean it doesn't exist. When they got to the blockade, which we never see them do because all of the games just skip this part of the journey, they drove past it, through it, or whatever. It really is not an important plot point.

The time/location skip implies nothing of significance happened between the two points, otherwise it would have been shown.

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Has it really been explicitly stated that they knew literally nothing was going on in the city? In the remake of 2 I'm pretty sure it's even mentioned Leon went to the city because he knew something was going on and had received a hasty phone call urging him not to go, yet he did anyway. Maybe a complete news blackout is not 100% realistic but it does make sense in a fictional continuity that very little info got out.

A complete news blackout is realistic, but the blackout would be limited to inside the quarantined area, not everywhere outside it. Raccoon City is a big place and there would be people going there every single day, whether it be for work, pleasure, or just passing through. The military blockading the city and refusing people entry would be impossible to hush up in any meaningful way, the best they can do is come up with a cover story to explain it. A comparable event here would be the 1947 Roswell incident where the Army couldn't hide that one of their top secret toys crashed, but they were able to fabricate a myriad of different stories (including the UFO one) to keep what really happened under wraps.

The series has to operate on some rules of reality. All fiction does, including zombie fiction. Otherwise who's to say Leon can't just wipe out the virus or its byproducts by simply snapping his fingers, Claire can't psychically view Chris' location instead of having to drive to RC to find him, or Jill couldn't have sprouted wings and flown back in through the window she tackled Wesker through?

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

Well yeah but... we don't even see a great stretch of the road from the gas station to the city. It's not like the city just straight up starts after they leave Mizoil. The soldiers likely just didn't fall back so much that any of it would actually be seen in the cutscenes that show very little of the road leading up to Raccoon. We see Leon and Claire leave Mizoil, then the video just straight skips to them in the city. We don't even see a mile worth of the road in the game and I'm pretty sure it was way longer than that. Every other iteration of the events either starts with the characters already within city limits or on a main road not even close to the city, apart from Outbreak that actually shows us more of the road, including the blockades. Just because we don't see all of the road doesn't mean it doesn't exist. When they got to the blockade, which we never see them do because all of the games just skip this part of the journey, they drove past it, through it, or whatever. It really is not an important plot point.

The time/location skip implies nothing of significance happened between the two points, otherwise it would have been shown.

Considering the outpost was presumably completely empty, literally nothing of significance happened. There is no reason to postpone the actual start of the game with two people finding a way around a roadblock or moving items out of the way. We didn't even get to play the second character's romp through the city to the RPD which would have been way more interesting and eventful (and was even part of the original game).

Ghost Leader wrote:

A complete news blackout is realistic, but the blackout would be limited to inside the quarantined area, not everywhere outside it. Raccoon City is a big place and there would be people going there every single day, whether it be for work, pleasure, or just passing through. The military blockading the city and refusing people entry would be impossible to hush up in any meaningful way, the best they can do is come up with a cover story to explain it. A comparable event here would be the 1947 Roswell incident where the Army couldn't hide that one of their top secret toys crashed, but they were able to fabricate a myriad of different stories (including the UFO one) to keep what really happened under wraps.

Like I said, not 100% realistic and that's why the official canon has given us the cover story instead of a blackout. Also like I mentioned, Leon in the remake was already aware of something bad going on although it is never expanded upon. Additionally we don't really know how many companies actually operated with other companies outside of the city and how much was actually operated by Umbrella to keep their cover. The city was quite rural and detached from the world outside of the Arklay County that itself only had a couple of small (canonically dubious) settlements outside of Raccoon. It was pretty self-sufficient as well and again, we don't really know how much Umbrella actually took care of other stuff. Since it was in the mountains there probably wasn't much traffic going through the city. We can even see in the original RE2 opening that there is a big main road with a seperate turn for Raccoon City that Leon has to take. The city seems to have been quite far from everything so prolly not much outside traffic.

Ghost Leader wrote:

The series has to operate on some rules of reality. All fiction does, including zombie fiction. Otherwise who's to say Leon can't just wipe out the virus or its byproducts by simply snapping his fingers, Claire can't psychically view Chris' location instead of having to drive to RC to find him, or Jill couldn't have sprouted wings and flown back in through the window she tackled Wesker through?

Bending the rules is a little bit different than just completely throwing them out of the window.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Considering the outpost was presumably completely empty, literally nothing of significance happened. There is no reason to postpone the actual start of the game with two people finding a way around a roadblock or moving items out of the way. We didn't even get to play the second character's romp through the city to the RPD which would have been way more interesting and eventful (and was even part of the original game).

Finding a military checkpoint, empty or not, would be a pretty significant event as ominous and mood-setting as the first encounter at Mizoil. It's not our job to explain these goofs, it's Capcom's. If Claire and Leon encountered an abandoned military checkpoint, it should have been shown. Even a two second glimpse followed by an uneasy "What the hell is going on...?" would have done the job.

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Like I said, not 100% realistic and that's why the official canon has given us the cover story instead of a blackout. Also like I mentioned, Leon in the remake was already aware of something bad going on although it is never expanded upon. Additionally we don't really know how many companies actually operated with other companies outside of the city and how much was actually operated by Umbrella to keep their cover. The city was quite rural and detached from the world outside of the Arklay County that itself only had a couple of small (canonically dubious) settlements outside of Raccoon. It was pretty self-sufficient as well and again, we don't really know how much Umbrella actually took care of other stuff. Since it was in the mountains there probably wasn't much traffic going through the city. We can even see in the original RE2 opening that there is a big main road with a seperate turn for Raccoon City that Leon has to take. The city seems to have been quite far from everything so prolly not much outside traffic.

I live in a tiny ass town of less than 200 people with the nearest major city being almost 30 miles away, but there are still non-residents passing through every day. Raccoon City is a major city with over 100,000 residents. Even tucked away in a rural area, it would still get visitors on a daily basis. Those Arklay Mountains would be a magnet for hunters, hikers, and campers. And 100% legit not trying to sound like a snarky ass here, but that big main road Leon was on is a highway, of which we have thousands of crisscrossing the United States, and the side road he took was the exit leading to Raccoon City. And the highways around where I live have signs for places that are ~500 miles away, so it stands to reason that there would be highway signs listing Raccoon City for hundreds or even thousands of miles around. It's existence would be impossible to hide, even for Umbrella.

At any rate, the cover story and communications blackout isn't the issue here, it's the absolute lack of any trace of a military presence that was supposedly in place, entrenched, and flying evacuees in and out a week before the protagonists stumbled blindly (or semi-blindly, in Leon's case) into the city.

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Bending the rules is a little bit different than just completely throwing them out of the window.

And it's not throwing the rules out the window to think that there would have been some visible signs of a military blockade, even if a portion of it had been overrun. As it stands, there aren't.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Mass Distraction wrote:

Considering the outpost was presumably completely empty, literally nothing of significance happened. There is no reason to postpone the actual start of the game with two people finding a way around a roadblock or moving items out of the way. We didn't even get to play the second character's romp through the city to the RPD which would have been way more interesting and eventful (and was even part of the original game).

Finding a military checkpoint, empty or not, would be a pretty significant event as ominous and mood-setting as the first encounter at Mizoil. It's not our job to explain these goofs, it's Capcom's. If Claire and Leon encountered an abandoned military checkpoint, it should have been shown. Even a two second glimpse followed by an uneasy "What the hell is going on...?" would have done the job.

Eh, I don't understand why it's such a big deal. The series has skipped waaaaay more important plot points and only explained some years and years later, not all of them even in-game but with supplemental materials and such. We already got the "what the hell's going on here" part with the gas station and anything more would have just been extending the opening too much with the characters going on about the same plot point multiple times. For the characters themselves it was more important in this situation to just get to the city. Besides, if we had ever seen a military blockade people would have started questioning why they didn't go out of their way to find more powerful weapons from the woods or something, which in turn would have just broken the game if they had. You just can't please everyone with any form of media.

Ghost Leader wrote:

At any rate, the cover story and communications blackout isn't the issue here, it's the absolute lack of any trace of a military presence that was supposedly in place, entrenched, and flying evacuees in and out a week before the protagonists stumbled blindly (or semi-blindly, in Leon's case) into the city.

They did. They literally did. It may not be shown in RE2 because that is not part of the stories of Leon and Claire but they did. According to Kevin's ending from Outbreak and a file named "Evacuation Order" from the same game the US army was trying to rescue civilians with Chinooks on the 24th, the evacuation point being the Raccoon Zoo. However, some of the evacuees were infected and caused the evac choppers to crash shortly after. Honestly, a lot of the evacuation efforts are shown in Outbreak, the whole point of those games being that they show us the struggles that went on outside of our main cast.

While only Outbreak shows the evactuation and quarantine efforts RE3 does show the dead Delta Force members around the Incineration Plant and Operation Raccoon City additionally mentions the city being quarantined and Spec Ops forces being sent in to help civilians and gather intel.

Like, this is obviously something they didn't even think about back when they made RE2 because they only wanted to make a sequel to a game that surprised everyone with its popularity but it has been taken into account time and time again when the story and universe has been expanded and fleshed out. Since these are already established facts that have happened in the series according to in-universe lore, yet the developers of Remake 2 still decided to skip the part, it just goes to show that whatever happened had no effect on Leon and Claire's story and is thus irrelevant. This is what spinoffs are for, to expand on story points otherwise left unanswered.

Mass Distraction wrote:

Eh, I don't understand why it's such a big deal. The series has skipped waaaaay more important plot points and only explained some years and years later, not all of them even in-game but with supplemental materials and such.

It's a big deal to me because I'm a storyteller myself.

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We already got the "what the hell's going on here" part with the gas station and anything more would have just been extending the opening too much with the characters going on about the same plot point multiple times. For the characters themselves it was more important in this situation to just get to the city. Besides, if we had ever seen a military blockade people would have started questioning why they didn't go out of their way to find more powerful weapons from the woods or something, which in turn would have just broken the game if they had. You just can't please everyone with any form of media.

If I had just narrowly escaped a gas station where the customers and employees were eating each other, traipsing around the woods at night just because there might be a few guns laying around would be pretty low on my priority list. Hell, there could have been one or more guns in every wrecked car they saw. Raccoon City is supposedly in Colorado, whose populace is pretty heavily armed. And I really don't see how a few seconds of visuals would have made the opening excessively long. It would have filled a long-standing plot hole, which seems worth it to me. It wouldn't have made RE2make into MGS4 with its hour-long cutscenes.

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They did. They literally did. It may not be shown in RE2 because that is not part of the stories of Leon and Claire but they did. According to Kevin's ending from Outbreak and a file named "Evacuation Order" from the same game the US army was trying to rescue civilians with Chinooks on the 24th, the evacuation point being the Raccoon Zoo. However, some of the evacuees were infected and caused the evac choppers to crash shortly after. Honestly, a lot of the evacuation efforts are shown in Outbreak, the whole point of those games being that they show us the struggles that went on outside of our main cast.

Some residual signs wouldn't have altered the story in any way, just like the encounter at Mizoil didn't. Passing an abandoned military checkpoint, hearing helicopters flying around in the background, some dead soldiers during the painfully short trek to the police station, that kind of thing. It doesn't need to play a direct role in the story, just a brief conversation between Claire or Leon and Marvin on the topic would have sufficed.

Claire/Leon: *looks up* "Is that a helicopter?"
Marvin: "Could be the military. They've been flying people out of here ever since this started."
Claire/Leon: "I saw a checkpoint and dead soldiers on the way in. But I don't think we can count on them showing up any time soon. We need to find a way out."

From that point, the story and game goes on normally. It almost seems like RE2 happens in a bubble sealed off from the rest of the world.

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Like, this is obviously something they didn't even think about back when they made RE2 because they only wanted to make a sequel to a game that surprised everyone with its popularity but it has been taken into account time and time again when the story and universe has been expanded and fleshed out. Since these are already established facts that have happened in the series according to in-universe lore, yet the developers of Remake 2 still decided to skip the part, it just goes to show that whatever happened had no effect on Leon and Claire's story and is thus irrelevant. This is what spinoffs are for, to expand on story points otherwise left unanswered.

In the original, this plot hole is justified in that Capcom simply hadn't expanded the Raccoon City incident yet. When making the remake, this had all been well-established in over two decades of Resident Evil history. And with the  Raccoon City outbreak being the backdrop of the game, it becomes very relevant.

Honestly the REmake should have just shown a quick scene after the gas station of Leon and Claire driving through a broken and bloody blockade.

Leon: "What the hell?".
Claire: "I hope Chris is O.K.".

There, a quick and eerie tone setter. Would have solved this whole mess, and made the transition from country side to the city more smooth/clear.

Hey guys, I really love how they made the remake and Carlos is such a badass!

RebelliousQueen wrote:

Hey guys, I really love how they made the remake and Carlos is such a badass!

Agreed!, hopefully he'll get a nice extended role in R3make.

Bulls-3ye wrote:

RebelliousQueen wrote:

Hey guys, I really love how they made the remake and Carlos is such a badass!

Agreed!, hopefully he'll get a nice extended role in R3make.

From the trailers, he and Tyrell make a visit to the police station, which didn't happen in the original. There's some speculation that this sequence will be playable.

Ghost Leader wrote:

Bulls-3ye wrote:

RebelliousQueen wrote:

Hey guys, I really love how they made the remake and Carlos is such a badass!

Agreed!, hopefully he'll get a nice extended role in R3make.

From the trailers, he and Tyrell make a visit to the police station, which didn't happen in the original. There's some speculation that this sequence will be playable.

I noticed that too. I hope it's playable.

RebelliousQueen wrote:

Ghost Leader wrote:

Bulls-3ye wrote:

RebelliousQueen wrote:

Hey guys, I really love how they made the remake and Carlos is such a badass!

Agreed!, hopefully he'll get a nice extended role in R3make.

From the trailers, he and Tyrell make a visit to the police station, which didn't happen in the original. There's some speculation that this sequence will be playable.

I noticed that too. I hope it's playable.

Carlos is confirmed to have more playable segments than in the original and he and Tyrell visiting the police station seemingly without Jill would heavily suggest it is. The only screenshot I've found of Carlos definitely as the playable character was taken inside the hospital, though.

Spoiler:

The part where he is walking down the stairs outside of RPD did look more like it was being played, just from a different angle for trailer purposes, and not something scripted.

It was very brief so I could be wrong, though.

Mass Distraction wrote:

The part where he is walking down the stairs outside of RPD did look more like it was being played, just from a different angle for trailer purposes, and not something scripted.

It was very brief so I could be wrong, though.

Could you link that trailer so I can take a look?